So whats the difference between sitting grey or just folding? How exactly is it taking poker out of the equation? We are still getting cards and betting, most of the time losing, so whats the damn difference? Oh yeah, they fold faster so I guess that makes it different.
Craig,
With the 50% participation rule, even someone making a cash ( while grey before level 3 is over ), still looses the t-pts ā¦ Late Registration has NothinG to do with the squatters ( grey ppl ) or those who think they can still cash while never playingā¦
There are many reasons players go grey for awhile, but its all part of the gameā¦ learn to overcome these players to make your game strongerā¦ and BY GOD learn how to eat these ppl up when you canā¦ when youāre on a 6 person table, with 4 players, 1 grey, learn to ( without collusion ) just start playing only that 1 pesonās BigBlind, and everyone elseās BB leave aloneā¦ by doing this you can eat up a grey person really quickly while not hurting any of the exsisting playersā¦ as long as you donāt post in chat something blatent, Replay canāt prove collusionā¦ doing this is just smart gameplayā¦ nothing more.
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Agree Sassy ā¦ Greyed just add to the pot.
Soā¦ whatās the beef?
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Folding every hand IS taking Poker out of the game. So everyone folds every hand ? Whatās the sense of even sitting then at the table.
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Ok Iāll give it a try. Thank you for the information 
Well Warlock, its no different than the person who sits on the end and continues to take the dealersās bust card, playing Blackjack ā¦ just plain dumbā¦
Well Warlock, Summer SnGs, still pissād I had any DNFs, but slotted into 3rd so far, after my 15 minimumā¦ stupid rules(50%), but maximized what I couldā¦ weāll see how far that gets meā¦ ( playing within the format for promo )
anyone play cards in basement all nght knows you miss or sitout 3 hands forfet whates on table when you get uo you know if you are coming back or not thankyou
@1Warlock ,
Iāll be honest, if you were that short I might thro you a few chipsā¦ but I certainly will never admit in chat that is my intention. If ppl wanna take me for a walk in the moonlight close to a bubble, why should I complain. Lets face it Warlock, even if I donāt know you, ā¦ If you annoy my biggest threat, why the hell not antagonize him further by keepān you on the tableā¦ thats psychological warfare @ its finestā¦
Yes I know what you mean, and it bugs me too when I need the C-leader to act like 1 and not let the shorts limp in, but hey I cannot control that ā¦ There also is courtesy sometimesā¦ 2 tables ( 6/9 each )ā¦ if our table loses its 2 ppl, then they need to lose thier 1ā¦ sure sometimes Iāll keep our table pat + the 5th that gets rebalanced, and force them to lose 1 to make final table of 9ā¦
So I ask you Warlock, if it was me doing wierd things ā¦ might you not think " Mhmmm, whats that crazy girl Sarah doing nowā¦ lol " , rather than someone you never met and you thinkān " Wth are these idiots doing around here lately " ā¦ is that possible ??? I hope thats rhetorical, and that you can tell when its someone like me or a real idiot donkā¦ but god bless the donks, they pay for you and me to playā¦
(edit) ohh and Warlock, if you piss someone off ( too much ) early, it might be kharma that later on they donāt cut you some slack to make a bubbleā¦
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Warlock,
Are you trying to tell me you have never, been in a posistion where since the rest of the table didnāt act, its your choice to push the short out, and you donāt/didnāt because for whatever reason you decided to cut that person a break ???
Thereās just as good of chance of me :
- Letān you slide on a walk, if youāre super short ā¦ as there is if
- I raise you off your blind in the same situation, then claim I had to cause I had AK.
Yes your a friend, yes I like the competition, but 1/2 the time Iāll screw ya 10 ways to sundayā¦ and the other 1/2 Iāll play niceā¦
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Well Warlock,
Iām as cuthroat as it gets, Iām evil in using every adv. I can think ofā¦ yet there are times, when I just cut someone a break or help someone survive the bubble. My goal is to Win 100% of the time, but that will never happenā¦
Yes we play harder against those we respect, but it is possible to sayā¦ pick & choose , in a MTT / SnG, who goes on and who gets left behindā¦ ( Disclaimer : Iām basically saying its possible to take such actions, yet I stay within the current ReplayRules )
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Did the thread go all sideways or am I missing something?
Grey players to what ?
I think we went from:
- bringing up a proposed rule change for a disliked tactic (sitting out)
- how best to exploit the people who do this
- importance of knowing the rules and adjusting strategy
- the consequences of not knowing rules and strategies
- whether it is ok to bend/break rules situationally
So, yeah, went all sideways, did a U-turn and passed the exit again.
Edit: Deleting my posts and moving on. Not worth investing more of my time.
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RAPLHIE RARELY COMPLAINS-
BUT HERES A LITTLE ONE=
IN THE 1ST EURO HE PLAYED IN 2DAY-
AT HIS 1ST TABLE-3 PLAYERS WERE GRAY FOR THE 1ST 40 MINUTES!
UNTIL HE GOT POOFED 2 ANOTHER TABLE-
THEY WERE STILL GRAY!!
ANOTHER PLAYER WAS A BACK AND FORTH GREY GHOST!!
ITS SLIGHTLY FRUSTRATING AT TIMES-
CAN MAKE RALPHIE NUTS-
AND HE DONT NEED ANY HELP!!
NOT SURE WHAT CAN B DONE-
PROBABLY JUST VENTING FRUSTRATION-
OK- CHILL OUT U DAM SQURL-
U WILL GET OVER IT-
JUST EITHER PLAY W-
OR EAT UR DAM NUTS!!
TOM
RALPHIES SECRETARY
That was a great synopsis Iām good here too.
Thank you brother
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ok Warlock, how did u delete all your posts ( jealous )
that completely messād up this threadā¦
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Click the Elipses option**ā¦** opens up:
Share a Link to this Post
Delete
Bookmark
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Anyone can delete their posts, as Mickifin pointed out. It takes 24 hours but eventually they go away. As far as messing up the thread, I went all stream of consciousness earlier and took this thing off on a tangent. Sorry about that. Good points being made but all I was doing was frustrating myself and being a dark cloud over the place for others and thatās no good.
Now, I gave some thought to see if I could come up with a reason not to kill off the short stack intentionally and did come up with at least 1 scenario where it would make sense. Of course this was not the case in the situation I was talking about and it has nothing to do with giving someone a break because I like them.
Lets say you are at the bubble as the super-stack, meaning you have 5x or more chips as the next largest stack and there is one very short stack, If the super-short stack is to your immediate left and it is folded around to you in the SB, you may wish to give him a pass just to keep ICM implications as high as humanly possible on the medium stacks.
As long as the short stack exists and you have the luxury of being able to afford doubling up a medium stack if you are wrong, you can put maximum pressure on the medium stacks. There are almost no hands they can call your raises with until that bubble bursts so you can really run over the table until then. You can (and should) be raising with almost any 2 cards because no one can call a thing without QQ+, AKs. Had you eliminated that short stack and burst the bubble, a lot of that pressure would be off and they could start calling with wider ranges,
So, I did find a case where I would intentionally give the short-stack a pass but it is a really specific scenario and still has nothing to do with how I felt about a player.
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I love the advice. Fundamentally it is sound, but " No one can call without QQ+."
Is this for real??
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@Anhaga74
I know it sounds pretty out there but yes, its for real. Please use ICMIZER and you can run simulations for yourself and see where the profitable calling ranges fall. Here is a pretty common situation that generates a QQ+ calling range.
4 players left in standard 9-player Sit and Go, with top 3 being paid in a 50/30/20 format
Stacks are: (1 large stack, 2 mediums and a very short stack)
Cutoff: 10000
BTN: 2500
SB: 2500
BB: 1000
Blinds are 100/200 with a 25 chip ante
Assuming that the big stack is going to push about 75% of all hands, the profitable calling ranges for the medium stacks are: Top 1.4% of hands for the BTN and top 1.8% of hands for the SB. That works out to QQ+ and JJ+ respectively.
Of course in this example I have the short stack in the BB so there is the added consideration that he will call behind (top 38% of hands call) but you can mess around with table positions and still come up with ranges as tight as this for pretty typical scenarios. As I was playing around with the numbers, I was stunned at how insanely -$EV calls with hands like A10s were. Monumentally negative in fact. I wont even go into how negative calling with A6s is (private joke)
Without getting too hung up on the exact ranges, the takeaway should be that on the bubble, calling ranges for medium stacks need to be very tight. Calling with āprobably the best handā is a negative $EV play. In many cases you need to be a 65-70% favorite against the shoving range to get to +$EV (so that is 65%+ favorite against top 75% of hands). The gap concept is magnified to its largest degree here.
Its really interesting theory, for me anyway. Once you start playing with perceived ranges based on the people you are actually playing against, you can come up with a mathematically sound push/fold strategy at the bubble. Since the players here tend to be a ton looser in their calling ranges than most, you need to adjust your shoving ranges accordingly.
I could go on for a long time on this but Iāve already derailed this thread once and Iām afraid to do so again. Would be happy to discuss this concept with anyone though, along with just about any other strategy or concept.
Added: Going off memory here. I recall a hand I talked about in some other post a while back involving Sean Winter and Fedor Holz in a super-high buy in event. They were on the bubble and Winter was a medium stack in the cutoff. He opened AQo and was 3-bet by Holz from the button. Both blinds folded and so it was back to Winter. Since Holz had about 50% of the chips in play, everyone knew he was 3-betting extremely light. Still, Winter mucked the AQo without even taking much time to decide. OK, thatās AQ - a pretty premium hand. When you see the very best in the world making plays like this, it really brings home how sound the concept is and just how tight calling ranges become.
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Would you consider starting a new topic on calling ranges? That way we can get the whole 99 yards discussion?
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